The little-known political operative who acted as an intermediary to forestall the prosecution of state Sen. Jane Orie boasted of easy access to District Attorney Stephen A. Zappala Jr., passed along gossip the senator's lawyers initially hoped to use in her defense, and now finds himself in a legal morass with both sides wondering about his motives.

Robert Kramm, a former Democratic ward chairman who also describes himself as political consultant for the Laborers' District Council of Western Pennsylvania, has become a potential witness in both the case against Ms. Orie, the onetime Republican Senate Whip, and in a potential case against her sister, Republican Pennsylvania Supreme Court Justice Joan Orie Melvin.

Ms. Orie and another sister, Janine, today face formal arraignment on charges they used the senator's office, staff and resources for political work, notably the 2009 election in which Justice Melvin won a seat on the Pennsylvania Supreme Court.

In a Nov. 6 telephone interview with Sen. Orie's attorneys, Mr. Kramm said he had such straightforward access to the district attorney's office that he could come and go without checking in at the front desk.

Reached by telephone, Mr. Kramm declined to discuss his role.

"I don't have no comment about anything. I don't believe like half the stuff I read in the paper," he said.

The attorneys, Mark E. Seiberling and Tyler S. Graden, from a Philadelphia firm that represented the Senate Republican caucus, both kept written records of their conversation with Mr. Kramm.

According to the documents, Mr. Kramm appears to be the source of early claims by the senator's defense team that Mr. Zappala and his family were determined to derail both Sen. Orie's career as well as that of Justice Melvin.

He also told Sen. Orie's attorneys that both Mr. Zappala and his father, former state Supreme Court Justice Stephen A. Zappala Sr., were strongly supporting Jack Panella, Mrs. Melvin's Democratic opponent in the race for Supreme Court.

"Kramm also believes that a major reason the Zappalas supported Panella is because of Zappala Sr. involvement in casinos in Pennsylvania," the memorandum states, referring to the elder Zappala's position heading a group representing the state's casino industry. "Kramm said that, if Panella was elected to the Supreme Court, Zappala Sr. would be able to bring a lawsuit on behalf of the large casinos against smaller casinos. Thus, Zappala Sr. had a monetary incentive to ensure that Panella won the election."

Justice Melvin went on to defeat Mr. Panella and, the day before the election, Mr. Kramm claimed to visit the district attorney to discuss the race, generating yet another set of allegations that Sen. Orie's attorneys used in her public defense: personal hostility.

"During the conversation," Mr. Kramm is quoted as saying of Mr. Zappala Jr., "he called Senator Orie and Madame Justice Elect Orie Melvin 'evil people' who are 'vindictive,' 'vengeful,' 'mean,' and that they would do 'anything to get back at people.' "

"What happened was Kramm was warning the girls about the background into the Zappala family, whatever the heck it is," said Jack Orie, brother of the justice and the senator who took an early role in Sen. Orie's defense.

He said Mr. Kramm became familiar with Justice Melvin in 2003, helping with her first, unsuccessful run for Supreme Court.

"I don't know the guy's game," Mr. Orie said yesterday.

A footnote in Mr. Seiberling's Nov. 6 memorandum notes that Mr. Kramm suggested he might be able to settle the Orie matter privately with Mr. Zappala: "Instead of becoming involved in a public forum," the note states, "Kramm stated that he would prefer to speak with Zappala directly and warn him that he knows that Zappala is pursuing these allegations for political reasons. MES [meaning Mr. Seiberling] advised Kramm that it would be best if he did not take this action at this time."

Two weeks later, according to affidavits attached to a series of search warrants in the Orie case, Mr. Kramm visited Mr. Zappala Jr. in the district attorney's office.

The affidavit asserts that Mr. Kramm was carrying a warning from the sisters that they would launch a "Wecht style" attack against the DA. The reference was to an aggressive and ultimately successful series of blasts by former coroner Cyril H. Wecht against then-U.S. Attorney Mary Beth Buchanan, whose office indicted him on corruption charges.

Mr. Wecht's ultimate success over Ms. Buchanan is referenced, though vaguely, in the handwritten notes from the telephone conference with Sen. Orie's defense team.

Rather than derailing the grand jury investigation, the Kramm-Zappala meeting produced a new line of investigation, this one involving Justice Melvin: obstruction.

"Based on the previously outlined sequence of events," the affidavit reads, "your affiant avers that this threat of negative consequences outlined by Kramm (and alleged by Kramm to be at the behest of Senator Orie and Justice Joan Orie Melvin) is being carried out in retaliation and as a direct result of this criminal investigation continuing after the November 19, 2009 meeting, and further, these events appear to be aimed at thwarting this ongoing Grand Jury Investigation."

While declining public comment, those who have encountered Mr. Kramm describe him as a go-getter who insinuated himself with Mr. Zappala's office in the past five years by facilitating meetings between the DA and city police and local businesses in the Strip District as well as Market Square.

Sources in the office said Mr. Zappala cut off most contacts with Mr. Kramm after he reportedly exaggerated his connections with the district attorney in office in conversations with acquaintances.

Another source inside the office said Mr. Kramm couched his visit in the guise of hoping to warn Mr. Zappala of what could await him if he pursued charges against Sen. Orie. At that point, Mr. Zappala asked Mr. Kramm if he would be willing to wear a hidden recording device and go back to meet with the Ories.

"He got all white. I think at that point he realized he was way over his head," the source said.

While he had heard of Mr. Kramm bragging of a close, insider connection to the DA's office, Mr. Zappala said he was not initially concerned "understanding the political processes, that perception is reality" and that it might have made it easier for Mr. Kramm to organize meetings between local businesses and the police and DA.

Others said the boast was characteristic.

"What he does is he burns the relationship," said Bob Cohen, a longtime political operative in Pittsburgh who had met Mr. Kramm in various offices over the years. "He does something very stupid and the individual throws him out."

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